Listing Optimizations – How To Optimize Your Amazon Listings, Images, & Videos with David Dayon and Frank Acosta
Frank founded Creative Percent, to be a small, powerful bunch that isn’t afraid to break the rules, bring on the revolution and bend the status quo to help their clients dominate their markets. In fact, they thrive on it.
Creative Percent is wired to keep moving, to keep changing, to keep catapulting their client’s businesses to new heights.
David Dayon was born and raised in the town of Deal, NJ which hosts a vibrant Jewish community. He got his degree in Psychology from Touro College in Brooklyn, NY while already actively being involved with reselling branded products on Amazon. He later transitioned to working for an agency that was also selling private label brands on Amazon on a much larger scale. Next, he teamed up with his childhood friend to set up his own agency called AmazonXperts based on the great experience he acquired over the years with selling on Amazon.
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Listing Optimizations – How To Optimize Your Amazon Listings, Images, & Videos with David Dayon and Frank Acosta
– Hello everyone and welcome to episode 105 of two Amazon.
– Dustin, Dustin, Dustin, Dustin, Dustin, Dustin, Dustin hold on a second.
– Oh, you got something for us?
– Hold on a second, hold on a second, we got to make these guys feel at home. Hold on a second, hold on. ♪ What you know about rolling down in the deep? ♪ ♪ When your brain goes numb, you can call that mental freeze ♪
– Now we feel better, now we feel better.
– Oh wow I was not expecting.
– Now we feel better.
– That’s a good thing man, that’s a good thing.
– I was thinking to myself we always start with music, right? So I was like, man, we don’t have music now.
– Should we like tell them we start with music? I don’t know.
– No, no. We see you, we see you.
– Great job, great job. Perfect song choice, love it.
– Yeah it’s a good one.
– Thank you for having us man, thank you for having us.
– We’re pumped to be here man, we’re pumped to be here.
– That’s awesome. Yep. Well, we got Frank Costa and David Dayon on with us and we’re so pumped that you guys are here and we wanted to make you feel comfortable. Kris. Good job with the, the music introduction there.
– I love it, I love it. Crushed it, man. It was worth that little pause.
– Yeah I told you it would be worth it. I was like hello.
– It’s so much easier than like saying a bunch of words. No? Come on now we take the easy way out. We’ll just throw on some music, you know. Get everybody in a certain vibe, that’s-
– I love it.
– You tell instantly we changed.
– I knew, I know.
– About a 12 so yeah for sure music makes everybody happy man. Good job.
– It brings a new energy. It brings happiness and the people love it. So.
– We’re going to have to experiment with this, Kris. Cause we usually do the music post-production the podcast, but we’re going to maybe get it because everyone started bouncing around and got the energy high. I like it.
– Yeah so that’s something that David does which is crazy. I love it. If we invite somebody to our podcast. He puts them on the spot. Like what type of music do you like? Right? And then we’re like, all right now we’ve got to do with the music they like. Whatever we have some crazy ones, we got some great ones.
– We really, I think some of them were the best. Like we, we asked some, like one time we had a guest. We asked him for a song. And like when they answer that question it says a lot about them.
– About them yeah.
– Like you know what their vibe is. It sets the tone for the episode. So it’s a lot of fun. We like to do things a little different, have a little fun with it. You guys were saying you guys like to keep things light also. I don’t think there’s any better way. There’s a lot of podcasts out there. You just want to make content that people could, you know, digest easily. And what’s easier than just some good times and some good music and maybe a little bit of value too, you know?
– For sure, well talk about your podcast real quick. Let’s introduce you guys itself. So just kind of tell us what you guys are doing. Oh, we’ve got Frank and David on here. They’ve got their own podcast. Go ahead, go ahead and plug that.
– I’m going to take this one. We basically are coming to an end on the No-name podcast. We were 18 episodes in this week. We’re going to be, you know streaming our 18th episode and we’re rebranding, we’re reinventing, and we’re going to be starting up a New York Hustle Radio, Hustle Radio, for short.
– Wow, you gave the name huh?
– All right, all right.
– I like it.
– And we’re just going to be like we want the No-name podcast because that’s the name of our current podcast that we’re about to end and re you know, refresh. And basically we wanted that because we didn’t want to corner ourselves into specifically Amazon or even specifically e-commerce, but now we’re ready to say we want to talk about is the hustle, the hustle life, what we can learn from it. You know, things we can do. We have some pretty cool episodes planned. You know, the theme is something that we both feel passionate about. Obviously there’s a lot of room to throw e-commerce into there. You know, hopefully one day we can have you guys on there, but honestly, everybody has that hustle. Everybody has that thing they do that gets them to where they need to be and, you know makes them successful. And we try to, we’re going to try to dissect that and pull that out. Always keep it light, always keep it short. Our episodes are like, Frank’s always trying to like get them to record timing, to like, know like, hey how you doing? What’s your name? Have a great day everybody.
– Good to see you.
– But, you know, we try to, we don’t want to be, you know the longest episode out there like I said, easily digestible. Everyone does their own thing. Everyone has their own style, but ultimately I just feel like there’s a lot of, you know, there’s a lot of sharing sites. So we want to try to do things very different. That’s kind of the way we like to do everything. You know, why do a meeting, do a meeting over dinner. You know? Why? Like it just, it makes things much better. You think you think music lightens people up? Break bread with somebody and see, you know a stomach is the way a man’s heart, so.
– A hundred percent.
– You know, you get some good food, some good wine, some whiskey sour. I don’t know, whatever you got. It’s a recipe for success.
– So David definitely went like a few stages ahead. He went into the transitioning mode. You guys asked him how we started. And he’s like we’re evolving already.
– I tend to do that, that’s me.
– But legit the way that this happened is complete mistake. One day we decided to go live. It became a thing. And it was just like, all right, let’s make a podcast. We don’t have a name. I don’t care. Let’s not do a name, No-name podcast. Let’s just get rolling. And you, you know, it correlates with the hustle mentality that we have where, you know, we if we have our mindset to do something, let’s just do it. You might not always have everything, all the tools necessary. And you know, we didn’t have a mic set up. We’d never been on a podcast before. I mean, yes, invited, but never hosted one. And we’re like, yo, we want to do this. We started doing back up lives only, we didn’t became a real thing today. So yeah, just round up, you know, taking that risk. And then by mistake we have a podcast and thank God it’s moving.
– That’s such a great story. Yeah. You’re preaching to the choir here. I mean, it’s a very similar, Kris and I are just like we’ve got to start a podcast, no equipment, no nothing just do it. And that sort of speaks to that hustle culture. It’s like, if you just, just start doing something that’s the hardest step in anything. That’s the hardest step in launching an Amazon.
– So hard, so hard.
– That’s the hardest step in anything is just doing it. You can prep forever. But I mean, we were talking about this before Kris and I were on an episode, like 85 before we even got a camera that had any sort of like high-def.
– HD, I mean, it’s like, but it’s just the content that matters, and the networking, and the connecting, and just getting started.
– Yeah and also who you do it with, right? Like me and David are like, we have a lot of similarities, but we’re very far from spectrum. David wants to be organized. I’m like, yo, let’s just go live like, right? I’m like, let’s go. Let’s have a podcast every Tuesday, let’s have a podcast whenever, right?
– So it’s like you get, it’s two people. I mean look.
– Frank, if I’m the one grounding us. We have a big problem.
– Yeah man, I mean, look at the end of the day, you know, you bring value to people, and you connect with people and yeah. I mean, we, you learn to love the podcasts, right? As you started diving into it, it becomes like part of your life so.
– Well, let’s talk just real quick, introducing yourselves and sort of your brief journey for anybody who’s listening who doesn’t know us, Frank, let’s start with you. How’d you get into the Amazon space? Let everyone know what you’re, what you’re up to right now.
– So, so I started my agency and I’m a branding agency, right? Where we do logos and the whole brand identity, the packaging. And I wasn’t necessarily catering to the Amazon world. I was just catering to everybody, dentists, business, offices, a few packaging here and there. And I did find that our best work was in the product space. So I was like, you know what, let me, let me like simmer down on the product space. Right? I shifted my agency towards product only, still not Amazon concept. Right? It was just anybody, let me help you get out there. I was dealing with a lot of people in Shopify, a lot of people starting a product, the beginning stages. And then I started getting involved with the Amazon world and I was like, wait, this is the only place to be at. Right? So once I, once I saw the power of Amazon, how everybody on Amazon has a product, how everybody on Amazon needs branding. I was like, listen, my clients almost here so. Right? So what was I sorta, I shifted my, my agency basically just to cater to people to have a product, where else to go than Amazon. Right? Everybody needs packaging. Everybody needs logos, everybody needs branding. And so that’s been my world for the last six, seven years. Right? Two years ago, I decided to do video. One of my clients asked me, he was like, hey Frank we love what you did for us. We love the branding. Can you try make a video for us? I was like, how the hell do you want me to do video? That’s not a service I provide. And they was like, yeah, but you know, we, we love what you did. I’m pretty sure you can hire a videographer and you can guide him, and you can direct them so that the video looks branded. Right? So I went for it, I tried it and I fell in love with the process instantly. Right? So I came to my client, I developed the video. It was like, great. Now we need another 20 videos for the other 20 other products we have. And it instantly opened my eyes, I was like wow I added a service to it. So I ended up doing 20 videos, right? And I was like, well, now I can own this area. I do it very well. I think I’m going to push it out to other people. I met this guy, I met David. I connected with an Amazon agency and forget about it. It was like next level, like hey we already have all these clients. They need video. They need your work. He connected me to a whole bunch of people and that’s all she wrote. Right? Like everything just started skyrocketing. Everybody started seeing the necessity for video. And look, I always say it all the time. I’m not an Amazon agency. I don’t want to be, I cater to Amazon clients but I’m a creative agency and those are my spaces. And you know, I don’t have a limit to. I don’t do no type of management. I don’t do anything with the actual Amazon space, but the creative space is where I live. And yeah growing everyday.
– That’s great. And it’s, and I think people don’t realize how important that creative aspect is too. I mean, a lot of people that they could come into that, and Kris and I talk about this a lot, they come into the business, I may have their brain work one way or the other through the very analytical or they’re very creative. And so if you don’t, if you don’t get out there and don’t tell the story of your product a lot of times those launches or anything else can sort of fall flat and you really need someone who can just tell the story of that product. So it’s a cool story. Just how you use that, and then you found the Amazon space as the niche that was really needing your services. Really cool. David, how about you? What’s your, give us your background.
– Sure. So I’m one of those people that started Amazon, like as like a summer job. I started out straight out of high school instead of like going on a camp and being a counselor. I was working in an office, you know, putting, you know, working on my resume, you know, for, you know just to get that job on the resume. And I didn’t think Amazon was for me. And in fact, I think I disliked it. I said it was, it was too dry. It was too, it was in its infancy. My first job was just creating Amazon pages, Amazon listings. And, you know, over the years through college I kind of always kept up with those jobs just because I knew how to do it. And then I remember like after college I went for like a sales job and the guy interviewing told me he’s like, I’ll give you the job, but you should you should be in e-commerce because that’s where all your experience is and you’ll get a better job in e-commerce. And he actually suggested me to a different job and I ended up taking the job and consulting. And basically I always say selling on Amazon and then consulting for Amazon sellers, two very very different worlds, but they’re both Amazon related. And then I worked for an agency in New York. They had hundreds of clients, very big agency, a very big scale. I ended up moving on from that. I was there for almost two years. I ended up moving on from that agency to another agency making partner there. We had creative differences and I ended up starting Amazon Experts about two and a half years ago, maybe almost three now. And what we do differently is we’re a little boutique on what we partner with clients, we manage our Amazon businesses, but we do it on a smaller level. And we don’t have hundreds of clients. We have a small list. We give them a lot of attention. We bring a team to the table. We also have a second model with Our Cart services where we just sell either image optimizations, or content optimizations. You know, we do EBC build-outs, we can build storefronts. So we have a bunch of services that we just sell. But, you know, we do Amazon all day. We love Amazon. And just to add to Frank’s side of like he was telling you about how he met me and, you know that’s when everything got crazy, I sent him one client. He under promised and over delivered which is always a good sign. I’ve been through a bunch of agencies who make videos and there’s good people out there, but I’ve never dealt with somebody who, I mean, till now, I don’t know how many videos we’ve done, maybe hundreds by now and I’ve never had one revision. Frank nails it every single time on the first try, which I, my process we have revisions part of what we do, but somehow he used to make commercials and every single video is literally a commercial. But just to let you know I didn’t introduce him and then just introduced him to everybody I know. He did an amazing job for one, did an amazing job for two, and then I wasn’t, when I was connecting with people I wasn’t doing him a favor. I was doing my client’s favor. And that’s kind of what started our collaboration so much more has happened because of that and after that, but just to add from his, you know, he said his point of view from that story and I wanted to give my point of view as well.
– Let’s dig into that. Let’s dig into those videos. ‘Cause I wrote that down here, and that’s a big topic obviously with ads and people getting brand registered. What’s the secret sauce there Frank? What do you do that just gets that immediate no revisions, like gets the customer’s attention? What are you doing there with videos?
– So I think a lot goes down to our branding process, right? When we are doing branding, right, creating a logo is not just a logo and going through that whole creative process of figuring out what to do, workshops to take, is all on the storyboard, right? Creating a good story board. If we can tell people what the product is in 10 seconds, why they should buy it, we did a good job. Right? So I think it’s more of our process and how we go, if I didn’t have the branding background that I have. I don’t think my videos would look the way that they look, they don’t like any other micromercial or infomercial that’s out there. I think that all our videos, tell a story. And when you can tell a story you can captivate people, right? So my customers ask me, will your video sell me more? And the reality is that people are more inclined to buy your product when they’re emotional, when it grabs your attention, when it stands out, when it’s different. And if you’re asking me what the secret sauce is, ’cause there’s a lot of great videographers out there, there’s a lot of great companies that do video, I think my branding background helps me do a branded video look a lot more different than everything else that’s out there.
– Go ahead Dustin.
– So you can put a video on your listing and then you can also use a video for your sponsor brand video ads. Do you have a completely different strategy for those two videos? I mean, are you trying to tell them, what does that look like? ‘Cause you got to truly capture somebody on those video ads.
– Sure. So look. So my videos, I over record, right? In case of the possibility where the client was like, you know, it’s not like designed where he’s like, oh, I don’t like it, let me go come up with a concept, you know, once you recorded your whole team, your whole production site was there. So the whole project was already done. So like, I go strong on, I don’t tell my customers, I don’t have no revisions, but honestly the last hundred plus videos I’ve done, hey Frank is it on Dropbox already? Five seconds after viewing it. Right? So, and I think it’s just a process. It’s sticking to a process. And as you asked, sometimes when I record a 30 second video, sometimes I can reproduce that to a 15 second video and get smaller clips. Sometimes we do a lot of stop motion.
– I’m just going to add on that point because a lot of my clients who are, you know, sponsoring their videos are basically requesting like he’ll do like a 30 or 45 second video that will add to the product page. And then they’re going to be requesting like 12 to 15 second clips, you know, very quick, very in, you know, you want to try, like you said capture that audience very quickly. You know, everyone knows from anybody who’s shopping on Amazon, you know is familiar with the videos popping up and you wanna make your product stand out. So obviously these videos are great. They’re always a lifestyle, which I think is kind of like, I mean you do the studio videos too, but like lifestyle’s kind of like, where’s your specialty. And I happen to love that. And it’s about getting those couple of seconds that really showcase the usage of the product or the features of the product, or just a good vibe you know, friends hanging out, laughing with the product but you got to try to get it done quickly. And I would say that you have a little more of a runway when you’re looking at the, when the clients on your page, they’re already invested. So they’re already looking, they’ll give you 30 to 45 seconds. When you’re just scrolling, if they don’t like it, they’re not going to activate the audio. And if they don’t activate the audio, they’re not clicking on it. They don’t click on it, they’re not pulling your page up. So you really got to do, you have a much shorter attention span. I think you really have like one or two seconds but you know, obviously we are not uploading a 10 minute video. I think I saw somewhere, they make that decision within one or two seconds.
– And what are you doing there? What are you doing there Frank? What are some tips? Like, you know I’ve got a product, I got a product. Yeah.
– Start with the product. Right? Sometimes I break that rule. I’m a big believer that our rules are meant to be broken. I live by the reality is show the product instantly, right? Because that way they’re on the listing. They already read the bullet points, they’ve seen the beautiful picture, have beautiful pictures before you have a video first of all. You know everything has to be up to par. I would say that if you’re a brand you owe that to your customers. Like for example, if tomorrow Amazon says you’re allowed to put three videos, put three videos. Like why are you not going to give your customers that? Right? If tomorrow Amazon says, hey you can add another picture to your listing. Add that other picture. Right? So I’m a big believer in giving your customers what they deserve. Right? One of the things is when you are at a video, in the first couple of seconds show the product and show its use. There’s two main keys show the product and why they should buy. For example, if we’re doing a video about a charger, show how beautiful the charger is and instantly show how quickly it charges your phone, right? Some people want to drag it out and they want to do like these extra extensive, long clips of the product. Nobody cares. Show the product a few seconds. Show why it’s good. Why they should buy it. Call it a day. And then all the extras, just making it nice. Right? So like David said, we incline towards lifestyle videos. The reason being is that if you opened my video, David you tell me if I’m wrong, they’re going to the 45 seconds.
– It’s just so captivating. Right? So we grabbed the beginning of the, we’re like we’re talking about the product and it’s like, all right, now let’s walk you down what this product can do in so many different levels. Right? So at that point, you’re just like just hooked to the video. And it’s, you know, it makes people want to buy the product even more because they visualize themselves as the model, as the actress, as using the product. They can see themselves using it. You know, it’s like kids, right? They’re watching Nickelodeon, they’re watching Disney. They want everything they see there. Right? So it’s the same thing with an adult where they can visualize themselves using a product, always use a model. I know a lot of other agencies say oh I got a white background, our studio, use a model because there’s humans that are buying it. Right? So they want to see a human interacting with the product. So yeah, use the model, show the product in the first two seconds of the video, and explain to people why they should want it. And then you get that down pat you’re better.
– I like what you talked about though, where in the videos how you capture them real quick, but then you show the use. I was shopping the other day I needed some product and I actually wasn’t really sure how I, it was like something to fix a baseball glove, and I wasn’t sure how to really use it. And I looked a whole bunch of listings. There was this one listing where their video was super well done. And it was actually been repairing the baseball glove with this tool. And it completely sold it to me. ‘Cause I mean, and it was a little higher priced, but the video was so well done. It looked premium. I mean, I basically got a tutorial along with it, with the product. And so I can see, I mean, it made the buyer experience for me.
– And you bought it Dustin, no?
– Oh yeah, absolutely. A hundred percent.
– You just have the key, the key, buyer experience.
– And this goes not only videos, right? Your listings need to be up to date. Right? And I think the biggest problem and with Amazon sellers is that to an extent they believe they’re experts. Right? And they believe that, they’re like I know my product more than anybody else. Yeah that’s true, but there’s a lot of experts that know Amazon a lot more than you do. They know what trends are selling. They know what’s hot right now. And sometimes you just need to be guided by that, right? Yes, you know your product more than us because you’ve been to China. One thing is a product and one thing is selling it on Amazon. Right? So it’s just allowing yourself to understand that there’s people that are doing this at a high level, and they know what they’re doing, and it’s obviously working for multiple people. So, you know, I always tell people, I had a client recently that he reached out to me, he’s like yeah but I can get this video on Fiverr for $25. I was like look go ahead I’m not stopping you. Go over there, get it done. Whatever, he was negotiating with me. He called me back in 48 hours. Like, listen, Fiverr’s not working out. The video is not what I was looking for. And I was like, yeah. So like, you know, I’m not telling everybody that’s just starting out go and get a high level video you’ve got to climb your way up the ladder. But at a certain point it’s like not profitable to not have, that make sense?
– Oh yeah.
– It’s free to not have what Amazon allows you to have.
– Well, I agree 100%. And it’s, I mean, and it’s all a matter of the competitiveness of your industry. I mean, or your category. If you’re launching in a category where there’s nobody else with any good pictures, nobody at your price point you could maybe do a kind of a crummy little video and have some success with it, you know but there’s no way it’s going to work in a more competitive niche or if that field gets competitive. But I really like what you mentioned before just talking about the, knowing your product. Sometimes I think it’s a disadvantage that sellers have. They know their products so well but they don’t realize they’re not conveying the message. We talk to people all the time. They’re like, no, you don’t get it. We don’t know why it’s not selling ours is the highest quality. I’m like, how am I supposed to know? I’m looking at your image, your listing how am I supposed to know yours is more higher quality than the one that’s half the price? You’re not conveying it. They just, they’re so in love with their product they feel like everybody knows that that’s the case. And sometimes that can be, that can put blinders on you as a seller.
– You bringing something up Dustin, that I want to touch on because you know part of what we’re doing with full management is where we’re looking at a business and we’re saying, what can we do to succeed? So it’s not just, you know, optimization of a listing you know, price strategy works into that as well. And I think that, when I say this, you’ll you know, you guys might know what I’m talking about. There’s like a general, or I don’t want to say general, but there’s the understanding that some sellers I’ve spoken to over the years have, where they think that you can’t be profitable on Amazon, or they think that you have to kind of bastardize your price to a point where it’s almost not worth it. Or I think I’ve heard a stat that said most sellers don’t even know if they’re profitable. Forget about whether they’re profitable or not. They don’t even know how to tell if they’re profitable. But like, I believe against I think what a lot of people say is that you can be extremely profitable on Amazon. I believe that if you’re not getting good margins, what are you doing? There’s no reason to build a business if you’re not going to generate a profitable business. So I always kind of say, it goes very well together and you can earn a higher price point by making your listing look great.
– Yo a hundred percent, a hundred percent. Look we’ve got to repeat that man.
– I said,
– I know, I know but this one is.
– It’s definitely not the first time you heard that.
– But the first one it smacks people in the face. So can you repeat that man? It’s like that’s so true. Repeat it, repeat it. It’s so true.
– So I believe that when you’re building your page if you do make, if you do your due diligence and you take advantage of all the real estate Amazon has to offer you, you are in it. Like you just mentioned, like you have another guy who’s half the price. Why are they half the price? Because they’re less quality. Explain that. And then when the customer is shopping online and they see, oh wow this is much better. Okay, then they look at the review and after they look at the image, they’ll read three reviews about it. They have to be invested into your product first. They have to feel that there’s something there. After that, they’ll do a little more research. So you have to take advantage of everything you have. And ultimately that’s what works. And you know, that’s definitely something I’ve been preaching for a minute.
– Your listing is like your office or like your real estate. Like you want it to be spotless.
– Yeah I know you were going to say that.
– All right Frank, go ahead.
– So David always talk about this. Right? You can have a building in the middle of times square the biggest real estate. And if it looks like crap inside, nobody’s going inside.
– No, not just a building. One of those souvenir shop stores that cleaned up, you know what I’m talking about?
– Oh yeah.
– People buying those, you know, a statue of Liberty dolls whatever.
– I love New York.
– I love New York. Yeah. The guy that I have I love New York threw up all over the place. Imagine you have a store like that and you just you turn the lights off.
– Your floors are dirty.
– You take the box, you empty it out on the shelf. Just throw everything on the shelf. And you close the door. Like you have the most prime real estate, pre Corona time. Don’t think about now, but the most prime real estate that you could ask for. There’s potential of millions of foot traffic today. And you’re not gonna, you’re not gonna design it? You’re not gonna roll the red carpet out and offer free drinks to everybody that comes in? I mean, that’s just good business.
– A hundred percent.
– It drives me crazy when in, Dustin you can attest me, and you guys too, when we talk to sellers and they say, oh, I can’t sell it. Amazon ads don’t work. My Amazon sucks. And it’s like, let me see your listing. One image, shitty title, no bullet points, terrible description. I’m like, well, you can’t blame the platform if you’re not going to put the time in to invest in the listing and make sure the listing is spotless. And I don’t know if they just don’t know it or they’re just lazy. They don’t care. But it’s.
– So true. There’s so many sides of the spectrum, right? We also have Amazon sellers that come to you and they’re like, Frank, well, I’m selling a $12 product. I can’t invest that much money in a video is not, it’s not like I was selling a $50 product like everybody else. It’s like, listen, we’re talking value, right? You chose what your product is, they’re successful in the low item there’s also success in the larger ones. Right? So at the end of the day, like you can afford it. Right? Like if you’re on Amazon, you have to be invested. It’s not like it was years ago where you know you got lucky. Right now to play the game, you need to have your A game, right? You need to be on top of everything. And the second that Amazon tells you that you can add another service product or whatever it is to your Amazon store front, be the first one to do it. Because yeah.
– Yeah, you take advantage of those things. When they roll out new features, you hop in it fast, because less people are in it. So you want to do it as fast as you can.
– Yeah. And you know what it is, it all comes down to your customers deserve it. Right? So I’m gonna, you know, you give a damn or you don’t, right? But you’re trying to sell at a high level, you’re trying to sell a real brand. Like if you’re over here selling tissue paper and you don’t care about a brand you just want people to buy it in volume, you know, because people also question that they’re like, oh what about all these listings that don’t have listing out formulations? They just have a picture and they’re doing well. I’m like, yeah, well, you know you’re not them, right? There in here for years, have been selling for years. Whatever works for them is not going to work for you. It’s 2021, right? You need to be able to be up to date, you need to be able to be up to date or you can’t really, go do something else, leave the Amazon world. This is what it takes.
– I love your analogy of the times square shop. Because if you take it a step further the amount of money you would have to invest to make a physical retail place look better than everything else is enormous. It’s enormous. The amount of time and effort you would have to invest to make your Amazon list.
– Not that much. And you have all that opportunity. And you have all that opportunity. So you gotta be all kinds of crazy not to take advantage of that, right?
– Yeah. It’s not much, and the foot traffic is going to be a huge multiple of what’s going through times square on your Amazon listing if you do it right. I mean, it’s just, it’s amazing. And it’s right. I love you guys’ passion about really just doing everything the best you can possibly do it. It goes to your hustle.
– So let me tell you this, and David doesn’t even know this one. So I had a customer reach out to me for videos, very expensive video. They needed a whole bunch of models. I give them a price through a door. I can not afford this. This is, this is absurd. I was like, all right, let’s do something else for free and I want 10% of the money that comes into that video for you to pay me, paying me. And he was like, wait, what do you mean? I’m going to pay you a lot more than what you’re courting me. I’m like, so what are we talking?
– Which one do you want?
– I was like do you wanna. I’m just throwing random numbers offer. You want to pay me 20K? You want to pay me 500K? Like where are you standing? All right so. And then, you know, it like blew his mind. And he called me this morning. He was like, yo Frank, you are not taking a piece of my business. Let’s just run with the video. Right? And it’s just reality man, you know. And this tactic. I’m going to start using it, with everybody, all right you don’t want to, you can’t afford me. I’ll do it for free, but I want 10% of everything that comes from that, you know, and at that point they’ll see the value in what you’re doing. And it’s crazy.
– It’s a good play.
– I want to actually take it to the next step guys, because again, you know, when you’re selling on Amazon it’s not just about getting the video. It’s not just about building a nice page. It’s about doing everything right. It’s about that full recipe for success. So, I mean, it happens to be next on the list. What’s next guys?
– You gotta pay to play there’s no other way to do it. And it just like, you’re saying like, you’re giving these stories or these hypotheticals because we’re not talking about anybody specific God forbid, but I’m giving these hypotheticals of these clients who are not really so understanding or they’re not making the right decisions. And you know, if I’m going to say a hypothetical the best one is the guy who says, oh no, no, no advertising. I can’t do advertise. It’ll sell on its own. And you’re like, what does that mean? You’re telling me that if you organically land and a hundred people a day and at a hundred people a day, you’re just, for argument’s sake, converting 10% of the time, 10 sales daily, that’s something and you get it steady, and you’re there. You’re at 10 a day. That’s where you are. You’re telling me you don’t want to go to the next hundred and get the next 10. It’s just like a joke. Like what, once you make a nice page you can make the nicest page in the world, you can have the nicest images, the nicest title, the best video, everything in the world. And if you don’t get extremely lucky with organic traffic or grandfathered in from years ago you could miss the boat or you could just not tap into even a fraction of what traffic is there waiting for you to go get. It’s like the times square idea, but you’re just putting a lock on the door. Sorry oh, we only let in 10 people. Corona, we only let in 10 people at a time. See you later guys, all the business. And that’s why New York is, you know,
– It is what it is.
– It is what it is, right?
– New York is New York, right?
– Just to come full circle on the times square.
– Yeah, for sure, for sure man. I mean, Amazon is a beast on its own and you need to nurture it. You got to give it what it wants. Right? If you had to drag it in your back yard, right? You have to give it what it wants. Right, right. It’s going to eat you. And that’s just the reality, man. It’s just the reality.
– You’re watching too much Game of Thrones Frank.
– Dude I am. That’s all it is man, you either feed it or it’s a wrap for you. Like you’re done. You have to give it what it demands. And again, this all comes back to your customers. Do you give a damn, right? Do you give a crap about what your customers think? What they say? You know, look, we all have apps on our phone, right? And every time it updates, like let’s say Instagram or an app that you love and you see a new update. You’re like, wow, this is cool, man. Or am I the only one that goes?
– No, no you’re good, you’re good.
– Like them I’m a big fan.
– Or like when the stories came in and you’re like, yo wow, now I get stories. Right? So that’s what Amazon is man, like you want your customers to come. I’m going to take it to an extreme where I recently sold the client. I was like, listen you need to do Christmas videos. Is a one-time payment, and you put them up once a year. It’s the biggest selling holiday. It’s crazy not to do them. Right? You pay for it once, next year Christmas comes around, you upload it again. What does that mean? That you’re being current with your customers. You’re being current to what’s happening. I’ve seen David do some amazing things where it’s like, Valentine’s day. You can correct me if I’m wrong. You guys will do like a one post where similar it’s like the holiday is going on.
– Yeah. So we’ll do, we’ll do it. When we do an optimization we design seven images for the page. Usually you have seven image slots. So when we design those seven image slots sometimes we’ll add in another image just for holiday season. So you can have a pair of boots and, you know, you can have the, you know, a girl wearing the boots you know, on our way to, you know, walking up a flight of stairs or something, or a nice street, street wear type of you know, you know, fashion, you know, image. And then during holiday season you might want to change it up. You might want to have, you know, a mother and daughter, you know, in a robe crowded around the Christmas tree with, you know, pulling the boots out of a box. And that’s something that you’re not going to really use. I mean, you can do whatever you want, but I don’t intend on using that all year round. But you know, for the month of holiday, you better bet that’s gonna, it’s going to help you with your conversion rate. And I mean, that’s really all we’re ever doing this for. You know, when we do an image optimization, when we do a content optimization, all we’re looking for is that conversion rate to go up, the unit session percentage to go up. And I’m proud to say that the highest conversion rate I’ve ever seen and I’m like, I’ve never seen this before in my life. If I go to like my second place, it’s nowhere near this but I have to say that because just how crazy it is, 90%. And I’m not talking about like one session, I’m talking about thousands of sessions a 90% conversion.
– That’s actually better than my no revision thing bro.
– A hundred percent, bro. That’s crazy numbers man.
– It was already very ambiguous like, and that’s, I love those people. Like there’s a whole thing about Hanes. The most purchased apparel item is a Hanes t-shirt with one image. So you might say and I love it when somebody it’s like it fires me up good. Someone said, well, Hanes doesn’t need an image. Doesn’t need two images. So why do I need two images?
– You ain’t Hanes.
– And I’m like, you, ain’t Hanes exactly. When you’re Hanes, when you’re Fruit of the Loom. You don’t need images. You can just, you can put a picture of whatever you want up there and just write this is a five pack of Hanes and people will buy it.
– Yeah. And they’re spending millions on all kinds of other advertising. I mean, it’s just that’s the way. I got to say, Kris quick, Kris, cause I gotta this. You guys just basically summed up the whole part of the hustle. When you just said changing your images for different seasons at different holidays. That’s next level. That’s stuff that you’re, I mean, even the best aren’t doing enough of probably where, and that’s what the big, big huge companies, you know, Nike’s and all that their commercials change for seasonality. It’s all Christmas. And you know, a little seller like me or Kris can easily do that on our own listings and have a huge impact. It just takes forethought, time, commitment, to really delivering, like you said, the best to your customers.
– And you want to know something? I’m in the branding space, right? And many with challenges. I feel like even if it’s just one picture you change. It was the last picture that you have the option to, where you make it about the holiday that’s going on. That’s all it needs, right? It’s not like you’re gonna go and change every listing, but if you have the last picture and we’re in Valentine’s day, or mother’s day or whatever the thing is, and your product is relatable to that, why the hell not?
– I’ll give you a best practice guys. That Frank just reminded me of, a lot of people I meet have optimized listings. Now I’m not gonna, you know, I’m not gonna brag and say I would do it better. Usually, thankfully, we’re very proud of our work. And most of the time if I’m designing, like I said, a boot, in my opinion, and I could be biased, it’s going to be the best boot on Amazon. If I have anything to say about it. So, you know sometimes I’ll meet somebody who has already invested with another agency to make beautiful images and they’ll tell me, what did I do wrong? What can I do to make this better? So a lot of times I’m not one of those people that if a, you know, a fish comes and jumps out out of the water onto my boat and says, eat me, you know I’m not going to just take it. If it’s not what I want I’m going to throw it back in the pond basically. So if somebody comes to me and says, hey, I did it. It’s not working. Can you help me? If I believe that they have a great project, I’ll tell them a lot of times don’t do anything different with image two, three, four, five, six and seven, change image one. A lot of times it doesn’t even require a re shoot. You could already have something you overlooked that just, your first image is the first thing they see. So, you know, you mentioned changing the last image, but change the first image. And if you do that, you’re giving a customer a different angle, a different view point of a product, and that a lot of times, without spending all that money on and you know, you mentioned Fiverr before somebody comes to me and says, hey Dave, you’re expensive. I could get this on Fiverr. I want to tell them, please do. Because if that’s the budget you have and you don’t have a budget for me, then you don’t, I don’t want you to be uncomfortable when you’re working with me.
– I go a little beyond that. I actually go Fiverr the person that Fiverr them.
– No, I don’t have time for that. But the point is, it’s more about, it’s more about like I don’t want a recipe for disaster. So if somebody is already complaining and telling me they can’t afford it why do I want to deal with that? You know, I mean, we’re going to deliver quality and, you know, unfortunately there’s like, we’ve given you the pre negotiated rate. It is what it is, you know what I mean? Like we’re, you know, we’re devoted to making sure the best result is given. And I think that’s why we have our revision process because it’s not always nailed on the first round. And we like to go back and we’re not as good as Frank just pulling the best out of it in one clean video. We, you know, a lot of times we’ll go back and forth with the client and make sure that we captured everything the right way. And that’s why we do have rounds of revisions to go over the images and make sure they’re good.
– So I have a secret to that David and I’m going to let it out today. He asked me, why is it so easy for you to not have revisions? And I’ve never mentioned this to him, I’ll mention it to him. He already did the pre-work for me, right? So if he’s sending me all these customers and the listings are already optimized I already know what to do, right? So when he’s starting off with a customer he doesn’t have any of that. He’s building, he’s creating it when his customers.
– What about a client that I don’t send you? That doesn’t use me?
– Yeah those I have to go the extra mile. But the reason that a lot of models that you have send to me have no revisions because the legwork was already done. So I go through your listing optimizations. You already pointed out the most important features, why the product is necessary, why buy it. So it’s easy for me to get that flow. Now if it was a customer that doesn’t have any of that it’s a longer process for us to do videos. And look, again, it all comes down to branding. Branding is the number one thing that you need. Everybody wants to skip this, right? Even David knows this, right? Even before like, branding is the number one step towards others. Especially when you have a new product that you’re coming out with, you need to look fresh, you need to look more in the market, you need to have your own identity because everything looks so similar. It’s so bad to the point where I see someone of David’s competitors and David, and I don’t mention names. We’re big on not mentioning names, and they copy his listing. Like, it looks exactly like what he’s created, right? So that’s going to happen often. The only way to stand out is for your brand to look different because that’s something that they can not copy. Everybody can copy like a listed format, or the way that it looks, or the style. But once you have your own brand identity nobody can come in and take that from you. So branding is definitely something that a lot of people look past, it’s an investment, it takes time, but it’s a hundred percent necessary to be successful.
– Let’s talk about, we’ve been talking about a lot about listing and images and stuff. Prime day’s coming up, prime day’s coming up, we’ve been talking about holidays and stuff. This is kinda like a holiday for Amazon sellers. Both of you answer this question, Frank and David, both of you answer this question. What would you suggest doing now in order to get your listing ready for prime day?
– Okay. So I guess I’ll go first. First of all, it all starts with inventory. We kind of, we touched on a lot today. We didn’t touch on inventory and that might be step one honestly, you can’t really do anything until you get inventory. That’s a big problem. I don’t want to open up a box right now with the inventory topic, you know, cause we don’t have another hour to talk about that. But yeah inventory is going to be number one, you gotta get down pat. If you don’t have inventory, better luck next year or holiday season start working on that from now. But if you have inventory, you’re gonna want to make sure that A, you’re going to be delivering traffic that day. Everybody and their mother is going to be doubling their budget. You might want to triple or quadruple. Or if you wanna get more aggressive, the more aggressive probably the better. And honestly, you know, I mean, you guys I’m going to take one back to you on the whole day partying thing because it’s a question I get a lot. And I originally thought it was the greatest idea. I might not love it so much anymore. So I want to kind of turn that back into a question to you guys. But as far as you know, prime day goes you have to have that inventory, you have to have the budget in place to deliver extra traffic because there’s a whole lot of people searching for stuff that day. Great idea, if you’re eligible for prime deals. Great idea, if you want to do some coupons at the very least do a sale price, I’m not sure if we’ll have the lowest price in 30 day thing again. I hope we do. And yeah, I mean, besides for that, it’s really simple. Just make sure you have the good, make sure you have the traffic, make sure you have some sort of a discount to try to catch that audience. And you know, all you need is a couple of people to click on your product, buy your product. And that will start a swarm. And anybody who sells on Amazon successfully knows what it’s like to benefit from that momentum. And really just ride that wave of success, prime day can make your year. It can be the ripple effect of what makes you successful. And I’ve seen that time and time again. I’ve also seen very aggressive discounts that, like one just to put it in perspective, I had one time a client who never really approved more than a 15% discount which is kind of a joke. One time, and they have very slim margins. One time they approved the 15% discount a week before on a group of listings. And then they went through another group and they by mistake included the same item again. And it was a very good seller. It was like one of their best, I think their number one or number two item, when they gave that extra 15% and pretty much, I think took away their whole margin. They didn’t make any money for those sales that they made. They completely stocked out very quickly, but regardless they sold so quickly and moved through so many units. And then after that the listing was like ranked extremely well in the category for years, years because of a mistake because of a mistake 30% off on something that they consistently gave 15% off. I think that also had to do with it. But you know, I, these events prime day, cyber Monday, black Friday these are tremendous opportunities. And you can either just take it like a regular day and completely miss it. Or it’s not like, what I just said is not that complicated. It’s not rocket science. I told you, stock your listing, pay for advertising, and give a discount. It’s not like a one, two, three. Do that and you have a very good chance of being successful. Good luck may the force be with you, right?
– There we go. Oh, look. Yeah, I can’t say anything better than what David said. My take is, make sure you’re fully packed. Whatever Amazon allows you to move. Make sure your equipped.
– Make sure you have a video.
– Yeah. Make sure you have a video.
– There we go.
– You don’t have a video, you’re suffering, right? Because your competitors are doing it. Even if they don’t have the best one make sure you’ve got a better one. Right? I’ll tell you now I see a lot of Amazon videos and people are being super cheap about it, right? And I get it because some Amazon accounts that have a hundred products and in their minds is.
– My favorite one is when you just see like a picture of the the item,
– In a white screen?
– Just like moving across the screen. As if it’s actually moving and you’re just like, what is this? Like, what am I watching here? You know, I just get dumber from watching that. Like, just because it’s like, wow pow, you know like what?
– A hundred percent. A hundred percent.
– It makes better video on Tik Tok.
– Yeah, true. You know, and a lot of people are like, oh. You know, I had one customer, who said Frank this isn’t working for me. I was like, all right. If you feel that’s true. Try one of mine. So he did one of mine. He saw how instantly it changed. He was all right., we’re changing everything now. Right? So it was like, you know like just isn’t logical man, when someone does not create it, and when someone that doesn’t have that talent come look at your product, your listing, your videos and turning that is shitty, excuse my language. It is what it is.
– It’s all right. I did it first.
– It is what it is. Like be up to date. Make sure you have a video, like not having a video is like not even an option anymore on Amazon, right? It’s like, you need it, you need it. It’s the new thing. Everybody’s looking for it now. David is only showing me that now on Amazon you’re scrolling up videos just pop up. You know it’s like be up to date man. And that goes to anything in life, just to be up to date.
– I love it. And I love the energy and passion that both of you have. I mean, and we just scratched the surface. We didn’t even talk about the other 5,000 topics there are to talk about in the Amazon space, but that’s, we can save that for a whole, another episode. We’ll have to get you guys back on and talk about all kinds of stuff.
– No, we have to get you guys on ours.
– Yeah, we’ve got to get you guys on Hustle Radio. We’ve got to get some.
– Love it, love it. We’ll definitely do it. But before we, before we jump off here, anybody who’s been listening right now and they’re like, man I’ve got to work with these guys. Quickly let them know how they can get in touch with you.
– So David is very easy. Amazon Xperts with an x, amazonxperts.com.
– With no e.
– With no e. You could also reach out to us on LinkedIn. We’re very active there. Please tell us that you came from here so that we know where you came from give you that extra attention and love. And for me creativepercent.com, you can also catch me on LinkedIn, super active there. If you do reach out, let us know that you came from here and we’re here to serve.
– That’s great. Well, I encourage everybody to do that. Anybody who’s looking to up their game needs to be reaching out to you guys. And like I said, we’ll do this again. This is an absolute blast to have you on. We love talking to anybody who’s passionate and having fun with what they’re doing. You guys are clearly having a lot of fun, doing what you do. So we’ll get you back on. But for everybody listening, if you like content like this, if you want to see Frank and David, when they come back on, make sure that you’re subscribing to our podcast on whatever platform you’re listening to us on. Also we’re live streaming these to Facebook and YouTube. So you can go to Sellozo’s Facebook page or Sellozo’s YouTube channel. Make sure you subscribe to there, turn on notifications so the video just starts playing on your phone when we go live and you’ll be able to get all this great content. Frank, David, it’s been a blast and we’ll get you back on again. ♪ I feel like an astronaut in the ocean ♪ ♪ What you know about rolling down in the deep? ♪ ♪ When your brain goes numb, you can call that mental freeze ♪
– All right. Thanks guys it’s been a great time.
– See y’all.
– Have a good one.
– See ya.